But Pelosi has never worried too much about what people think she cares more about winning.
And theres no one shes ever wanted to defeat more thanDonald Trumpthis November.
I think theyre dark.
Pelosi faces off against then-President Donald Trump on Oct. 16, 2019, in the Cabinet Room of the White House.Shealah Craighead/The White House
I dont get that.
I dont get that at all.
I dont like them at all.
We made my displeasure known to the people passing them out.
They have a hell of a nerve.
I mean, really?
What does that feel like?People have been very nice.
Young people will do their own, shall we say, representation of one thing or another.
I didnt even know about that [party], but people have been nice.
Heres my thing: Take all of that energy and just put it into the election.
We have to win this election.
My whole goal is that [Trump] should never step into the Oval Office again.
Hes anti- everything we care about.
He takes great pride in overturningRoe v. Wade.Its terrible.
Now, to make it all worth it, we must win.
I saw you on the floor during President Bidens speech on Monday.
Have you had a chance to talk to him yet?No.
Im a virtuoso legislator.
I know the issues, Ive been in congress awhile.
We share our Catholic faith.
We have shared values.
He wants to overturn what weve done to lower the cost of prescription drugs, to save the planet.
We were just discussing people co-opting your image.
You were being used in every attack ad in every race across the country.
Deportations
But disagreement is … thats the vitality of our system.
But what they were doing?
But that was a path right to my home.
Hes not here [in Chicago], but hes coming along.
Hes so lovely, so gracious.
Hes not really that political at all, for them to go after him [is] so sad.
And the guilt that I have for them going after me with him, probably, paying the price?
That was too much.
And then after it happened, they made a joke of it.
They thought it was funny.
They put it on their websites, or whatever it is they have.
The [former] president, his family, the governor of Virginia, whats that jerk Musk?
Whats his first name?
[Pelosi staffer: Elon.]
I mean, really.
Who would say such a thing?
When that person took a shot at the [former] president, we were all appalled.
But then, after some time, it became politically polarized.
How did that happen, from your perspective?
They said so that night.
They said so the next day.
They decided to revisit history and have a go at change what happened that day.
The House Republicans were ridiculous.
They didnt even vote to support the Electoral College that night.
But he always lies, so whats new?
For them, theres no way to cover this up, they just have to deny it.
I think that the party has been a great party the Grand Old Party.
And then they turn themselves into a cult a cult to a thug.
The [Democratic] Party needs the Republican Party to be itself.
It has a legitimate place, obviously, in the spectrum of opinion on the role of government.
Its been that way since the beginning of our country.
What some of the Republicans tell me is: We cant beat [MAGA Republicans] in the primary.
You have to beat them in the general election.
And thats what well do in November: defeat them.
I ran this time to double-check Trump never steps foot in the White House again.
How did you decide to step away from the speakership?
I took a big responsibility for the country, but also for my state of California.
And it just was time.
Thats why I hope the president comes to this place.
I had confidence in the new people coming up.
My decision was not to do it or not do it I was definitely doing it.
I didnt regret it.
And politically very astute, to get to your question.
Then the Senate, which was challenging, and then vice president.
And then choosing Tim Walz [as her vice presidential nominee] is just a stroke of political genius.
He was in the House for 12 years, he is a beautiful, lovely man.
He won, and he came courageously and voted for the Affordable Care Act immediately.
And then he went home and won.
Republicans are really going after him, attacking his recordThats what they do.
You are known for recognizing opportunities for political leverage.
Many of us, for years, have been supporters of the two-state solution.
That was when we were working toward our Sept. 30 end-of-the-budget deadline.
People have to understand thats where [the Republicans] have been.
Hes said hes going to wipe it out right away.
You believe a cease-fire deal is that close?That is my understanding, and my hope.
But we dont know what Hamas will do.
The civilian collateral damage is an immorality.
No, I dont think so.
I think that the people who lost, they voted against the infrastructure bill.
This is a very big, important bill.
They wanted to stop me, but I went and got Republican votes so I could pass it.
That was not the right vote [for them], policy-wise, [or] politically.
Thats what was used against them.
Their races might have been salvaged by that [vote].
I dont like big, big money coming into a race and disrupting the dynamic.
But what is the argument against the infrastructure bill?
Oh, I think it could have been better?
Oh, I wanted other stuff to happen?
It was never going to happen with our United States Senate.
So what was strategic about that?
This is about jobs.
This is about infrastructure.
It was really a step forward.
Theres so much in there, and it was some about [environmental] justice.
It was about equity, and they were voting against it?
I think that was more of a problem for them than any of the outside money.
I went with my parents.
My father was mayor of Baltimore.
We went with the whole Maryland delegation.
My father didnt fly, so we went by train.
It was 52, it was here [in Chicago].
Being raised in Little Italy in Baltimore, we didnt have anybody in the neighborhood with names like that.
The donkey ended up being named Adlai.
The power center of our home was my mother for the home, but also for politics.
She loved the volunteers.
My whole thing about outside mobilization springs from that.
The politics I grew up in, it was from the people.
It was none of this This is what were going to do, and well tell everybody.
I say, Thats not what you say.
You give yourself a gold star, because thats a big accomplishment.
When I ran for Congress, people would say to me, Whos taking care of your children?
I know the issues, Ive been in Congress a while.
And I always use my time very well.
Time is very important.
And I said to my colleagues, Theyre going to lose.
Of course, they had to pull the bill.
The College of Catholic Bishops opposition to the Affordable Care Act was very intense.
Youre a devout Catholic.
I respect the opinion they have about abortion, thats their position.
John Lewis wrote the first 300 pages of the For the People Act.
And, of course, the Voting Rights Act is named for him.
We cant get the Republicans to do any of it, but its what we have to do.
Its horrible, and it takes away the confidence everyday people have about the power of their voice.
They have to know their voice, their vote, is as powerful as anyones.
That Constitution was drafted by our visionary founders, and it says two votes per state.
Thats in the Constitution.
But thats in the Constitution, and we take an oath to protect and defend it.
The fact that there is a 60-vote requirement is, in my view, undemocratic.
Thats just not right.
I dont know why they havent done it before.
We could pass an immigration bill.
We could pass, first and foremost, our voting rights and For the People Act.
Think of all the things we could do if we didnt have a 60-vote requirement.
And that is not in the Constitution.
We have to win the Senate.
When you say they, is that Leader Schumer?
Leader Schumer, yes.
We consider [the Senate] a convoy going as slow as the slowest ship.
I talked about the 60 votes, but in some instances, 99 senators are not enough.
Nobody wants to hear from a new member of Congress.
Just: Yes, Ill uphold the Constitution.
So then Im starting to go up there, and these same people are saying, Be short!
I go to sit down, and theyre all in a fluster, these members.
Oh, my God.
I said, What?
How much shorter could I have been?
I was not prepared for discrimination.
Youre running for your 20th term in Congress this November.
This is a mission.
People said, Well, he won in 16 …
I said, Well, people didnt know, but now we know.
We know that he is in defiance of the oath of office and wants to terminate the Constitution.
But we have to have Hakeem [Jeffries] as speaker on Jan. 6 of this coming year.
Can you tell me about your relationship with Hakeem Jeffries?
I understand that you were involved in elevating him as your successor.No, he was elevated by the members.
He has a great deal of respect in our caucus from the members.
Hes really a wonderful legislator, which is part of the job.
And hes capable of that.
